Author Time for Valve Clearance Check  (Read 3579 times)

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  • Offline profpatpending   gb

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    Offline profpatpending

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    Time for Valve Clearance Check
    on: August 25, 2021, 01:29:16 pm
    August 25, 2021, 01:29:16 pm
    Does anyone have any information on typical time it takes for the valve clearance check (2016 S1000XR) (Including removal/replacement of plastic etc). or Even BMW official timings. Obviously a first timer will probably double or even triple the time taken by an someone who has performed this several times. Just interested in how much time I should block out to complete the operation.

  • Offline brickit   gb

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #1 on: August 25, 2021, 03:03:05 pm
    August 25, 2021, 03:03:05 pm
    As a relative amateur, who had got as far as replacing spark plugs on on other bikes, getting to the valve clearances on the Mk1 XR isn't that complicated, if you are brave and methodical.
    I did mine under Mark Barrett's  supervision in his workshop at Anglesey, see https://www.s1000xr.uk/index.php/topic,3971.0.html      I will try it myself next time.
    If all goes to plan, one day is enough. We did it, but things don't always go smoothly, there were two of us, but only one knew what he was doing and it only takes a small glitch to lose several hours.
    From my limited experience, as a newbie, alone, without glitches, allow 2 days. This assumes:-
      You have a good manual, but limited prior experience.
      Have all the consumables at hand. You'll also need some valve shims if the clearances are out. If that is the case, add more time.
      Take lots of photos when dismantling. This is so useful when re-assembling, especially to check what goes where, but also to check the routing for different cables and hoses. Bad routing only becomes apparent when you have nearly finished assembly, (it is a Law of Nature), so everything then has to be undone! (That's how you get experience).
      The only special tool you'll need besides a good range of the standards, is perhaps, a puller for the plug caps, which are pretty stiff.
      Be prepared to replace the 4 circlips on the throttle bodies.
      And of course, it all assumes you don't break or lose anything and the bike runs properly.  :003:
      Good luck. Let us know how you get on.  :152:
       

  • Offline profpatpending   gb

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    Offline profpatpending

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #2 on: August 25, 2021, 03:57:13 pm
    August 25, 2021, 03:57:13 pm
    Useful Advice- I have Mark's manual, so at least I'm starting in the right place. Thanks for the warnings re cable routing and throttle circlips. Also the photos suggestion. I always try to take photos but for some confounding reason, no matter how many you take, the exact one you require is frequently not among them!
     As a matter of interest what are people's experiences re Valve clearances and how frequently shims require changing and at what mileage?

    Here's a question for fellow engineers;

    Would it not be possible to check clearances in the following way?

    Provide a regulated pressure air supply to the relevant (closed) cylinder through the spark plug port- A simple flow indicator on the air line can then be used to show the engine angle at which the relevant port opens. When the flow shows a definite step (as the valve opens), the engine angle will be an indicator of clearance. Only if this was out of tolerance (too early meaning not enough gap, too late meaning too much gap) , would it then be necessary to actually  carry out the full shim changing routine.
    Last Edit: August 25, 2021, 04:01:03 pm by profpatpending

  • Offline Crosshairs   us

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #3 on: August 25, 2021, 06:09:23 pm
    August 25, 2021, 06:09:23 pm
    *Originally Posted by profpatpending [+]

    Here's a question for fellow engineers;

    Would it not be possible to check clearances in the following way?

    Provide a regulated pressure air supply to the relevant (closed) cylinder through the spark plug port- A simple flow indicator on the air line can then be used to show the engine angle at which the relevant port opens. When the flow shows a definite step (as the valve opens), the engine angle will be an indicator of clearance. Only if this was out of tolerance (too early meaning not enough gap, too late meaning too much gap) , would it then be necessary to actually  carry out the full shim changing routine.

    clearances that are too tight at room temperature and will be out of spec  at operating temperature will not  show up in your method. A clearance of .001 would pass your test but could  burn an exhaust  valve if left unattended . .....your method  also provides no way of checking if they are too loose.
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  • Offline smithy   au

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #4 on: August 25, 2021, 08:29:02 pm
    August 25, 2021, 08:29:02 pm
    *Originally Posted by Crosshairs [+]
    clearances that are too tight at room temperature and will be out of spec  at operating temperature will not  show up in your method. A clearance of .001 would pass your test but could  burn an exhaust  valve if left unattended . .....your method  also provides no way of checking if they are too loose.

    What Crosshairs said....and it is very important to take notice of what he has said in regards to carrying out this service requirement properly, trying to skimp on the proper procedure is asking for trouble. He is spot on. :169:

    I did my valve clearances, along with a lot of other things at the 30k km service. If you've got the time, space and special tooling required...it's not terribly difficult, just time consuming. Removing and replacing all the "tupperware" is a very time consuming part of the exercise. The actual checking of valve clearances is not difficult at all, again, just time consuming removing all the gubbins including the tank, airbox, primary & secondary injectors, wiring harnesses, throttle bodies, rocker cover etc. All my valve clearances were in spec....although one or two were close to their limits...but they're either in or they're not. :016: If the clearances are not within spec, you'll need a set of shims and the cams will need to come out to replace the offending valve shim/s, this will add a couple of hours onto the job as it "ain't easy" to remove the cams, fit the correct shim and reset the cam timing correctly without the correct tooling etc. You don't necessarily need BMW's speacial tools as home made equivalents will suffice as long as the final result is correct.

    The clips which go on the rubber manifold/throttle bodies are also a difficult thing, I found it easier to just replace them with special narrow stainless jubilee clips rather than re-use the silly original ones which require special pliers to remove and replace correctly.

    I allowed myself two days to do the full 30k km service, but this also included a tyre replacement, fork oil, brake fluid and coolant change...I also replaced my chain & sprockets at the same time. I suspect someone reasonably handy with spanners and with access to the right tooling etc could do just a valve clearance check in a few hours though...assuming no other service items were required.

    I do have a proper motorcycle work ramp/platform, tyre changing machine and a GS-911 for all the "non-normal" service, brake bleed and module/stepper motor/throttle valve reset/learn items though which makes things much easier as I can do everything required by myself in my own shed in my own time whilst having a nice cup of tea and a few biscuits as I contemplate my navel between service items..  :001: :028:.

    Saves a "LOT" of money being able to do this yourself.

    Smithy.
    Last Edit: August 31, 2021, 11:37:21 pm by smithy
    When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my Grandfather....not screaming like the passengers in his car..!

  • Online bazzer   gb

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #5 on: August 26, 2021, 08:08:49 am
    August 26, 2021, 08:08:49 am
    I would say if you have never done it before and never taken all the panels etc off then allow at least a whole day to do it. Its much quicker once you know how everything comes off, but first time I would allow the whole day.

    I have been told that Mark has a way of checking the valve timing without the BMW tools in his manual. I just used the BMW tools.

    Its fairly straight foward actually checking the clearances, just takes a while to get the cam cover off :-)

    You method of pressurising the cylinder is known as a leakdown test and there are tools for measuring the amount of leak down. I did this on my engine and cyl 1 and 2 inlet  valves were leaking really badly. I suspect its carbon build up on the valves. I fitted a spare 2018 engine but I will investigate and sort it out on the original engine at some point :-)

    All the valves were in spec though :-)


  • Offline ch2004   scotland

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #6 on: August 26, 2021, 08:47:08 am
    August 26, 2021, 08:47:08 am
    I performed my 18k service over the winter and took 2 weeks!

    I could not have done it without Mark's Manual. It is clear and methodical. I do have a bike ramp and space to lay out everything as I took it off.

    It took so long as the bike was off the road over the winter and I was in no hurry. I carried out the full service and also replaced the chain and sprockets at that time. The service can be performed in a day but I spent time cleaning (+ACF50) all the nooks and crannies that you don't usually get to.

    A problem, that took three days, was the fuel gauge did not work after reassembly. I ended up taking the tank apart measuring and checking the wiper, scratching my head etc. Finally I put it on again and ran the bike for a few miles and it started working as it should. Probably just needed to talk to the ecu to wake up properly.

    All my valves were in tolerance but there was a very slight carbon buildup on intake valve for Cyl 1. which I removed carefully. This took me a few days as I was in no hurry.

  • Online bazzer   gb

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #7 on: August 26, 2021, 10:04:00 am
    August 26, 2021, 10:04:00 am
    Just thought I would add I did mine at 30K miles not 18K so carbon build up was a bit more.


  • Offline AdzventureXR   kr

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #8 on: August 29, 2021, 11:27:31 pm
    August 29, 2021, 11:27:31 pm
    I would recommend Marks manual as he has good tips and the bmw service manual as it is more detailed. Most valves are still in at 30k. For me valve cover was pain to fit with the sealant applied and not much room to work on. I actually released the top of the rad to have little more access room. I would recommend 2-3 8hr days for service. Probably going to run into clips, dirt and other crap that should be easy but just doesn't want to go easily. Take your time and take alot of pictures for reference. Pick a good quality sealant too and recommend new valve cover gasket. Make sure you have have special plug tool. Good luck
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  • Offline smithy   au

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    Re: Time for Valve Clearance Check
    Reply #9 on: August 30, 2021, 12:48:03 am
    August 30, 2021, 12:48:03 am
    *Originally Posted by AdzventureXR [+]
    Pick a good quality sealant too and recommend new valve cover gasket. Make sure you have have special plug tool. Good luck

    I find the "Three Bond" used by Honda is good stuff for this application. Used it on mine with good results.

    https://www.onlineautoparts.com.au/products/ZPN-55898?noseo=true&c=AU&gclid=CjwKCAjw4KyJBhAbEiwAaAQbEyudaI9lEeDyKkJpJeknZ2ZgV27uRF2vPsd5eRwxvZTkrz35tAo51xoCQYUQAvD_BwE

    Smithy.
    When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my Grandfather....not screaming like the passengers in his car..!