Standard bike dyno tune results

[HelenM]

It's no secret that manufacturers conforming to emissions regulations strangle performance but I do question how much gains you really get from expensive noisy headers and a filter and are they worth all the expense or is most of the gain just down to the dyno tune needed to fix the messed up fuelling. We had our standard bikes dyno tuned by BHP UK and they managed to achieve a 12bhp / 6ft-lbs power increase without even raising the rev limiter. 40% throttle smoothing is more than noticeable. The bikes now power wheelie by the throttle alone from 4000rpm in dynamic pro. Before the tune if we wanted to get the front up the only way was to clutch it up. Just wondering what additional gains are others getting with headers and filter ? 

[smithy]

Interesting the video says "2020 BMW S1000XR"...when it is clearly a Gen-1.

Dyno performance gains are very "subjective" and no two dynos are the same. Your "pre-tune" numbers look a bit low to me, most stock XR's are around 153-ish hp at the wheel, your 148hp suggests a bit of poetic license by the dyno operator to make their post tune numbers look better, happens very often. Unless it has been "decatted", it'll never breath as BMW originally intended. The Euro-4/5 emissions rules BMW has to comply with has taken care of that.

Fitting quality headers (Akra or Arrow) and a decent tune often brings them to around 165-ish at the wheel. It's the smoothing out of the poor low/mid range fueling and better "rideability" which makes the biggest difference. Some dyno operators claim much more hp, up near RR numbers, but without some serious engine modifications it's basically not possible.

Smithy.

[Antares]

Originally Posted by HelenM

It's no secret that manufacturers conforming to emissions regulations strangle performance but I do question how much gains you really get from expensive noisy headers and a filter and are they worth all the expense or is most of the gain just down to the dyno tune needed to fix the messed up fuelling. We had our standard bikes dyno tuned by BHP UK and they managed to achieve a 12bhp / 6ft-lbs power increase without even raising the rev limiter. 40% throttle smoothing is more than noticeable. The bikes now power wheelie by the throttle alone from 4000rpm in dynamic pro. Before the tune if we wanted to get the front up the only way was to clutch it up. Just wondering what additional gains are others getting with headers and filter ? 

Interesting, because it's actually the headers that provide the power, not the tune, so I'm not sure I believe those numbers. I'm on the opposite end of the stick, I just put on headers, yet to tune it, and there is a DEFINITE increase in midrange power even without a tune, like drastic differences. I'm 1 tooth down on the rear so less aggressive acceleration, not by much but enough that the bike comes up noticeably harder, pre headers 3rd gear was hopeless even yanking it and in power band without clutch, now it comes up with a light nudge and absolutely floats it over crests, this is a tangible difference, not some butt dyno observation. There are a lot of people here too that did stock tunes too and reported little to no gains only smoother throttle as promised.

Re: you saying the bike now power wheelies at 4000rpm I assume you mean in 2nd gear and I'm willing to bet that's the result of the removal/reduction of low gear restrictions rather than actual power gain, even in DP the bike won't give you absolutely everything. It's a very similar case to another topic that was posted recently claiming 30% increase in power. I'd wager your post 6k to redline numbers are barely higher in 2nd gear and practically no difference in 4,5,6 If you can prove me wrong otherwise do so please because I'm interested too, all it'll mean is when I get my bike tuned it'll be absolutely bonkers, even more so than now.

[Winger]

Always said to folks when asking about bikes I’ve had mapped, read where the TUV do their test just adding fuel their makes a monumental difference, i’ve Posted plenty on here over the years about mine, but for me the really big plus is when i’m Two up in heavy traffic and probably not paying attention....I can be in any gear including 6th at 25mph and it’ll pull as clean as a whistle.

But probably not keeping the world all that green....

[Antares]

Originally Posted by Winger

Always said to folks when asking about bikes I’ve had mapped, read where the TUV do their test just adding fuel their makes a monumental difference, i’ve Posted plenty on here over the years about mine, but for me the really big plus is when i’m Two up in heavy traffic and probably not paying attention....I can be in any gear including 6th at 25mph and it’ll pull as clean as a whistle.

But probably not keeping the world all that green....

I've caught myself riding in much higher gears at similar speeds with the headers too, I was unsure if it's due to increased low end torque or just bad muscle memory due to the actual tone of the exhaust changing, but I'd only notice when i was going down the gears that I was actually higher up, nothing as far as smoothness goes, 1st and 2nd are as sh#t as ever though, definitely need that tune to fix those.

[HelenM]

Just to clarify the YouTube video is not one of our bikes, it was a promotional video I saw prior to getting our bikes done.  As I understand it different dyno's can give different results but as I have a before and after results from the same dyno you can't really argue with the increase.  My question was how much extra increase would you get from adding headers and filter?

[smithy]

Originally Posted by HelenM

Just to clarify the YouTube video is not one of our bikes, it was a promotional video I saw prior to getting our bikes done.  As I understand it different dyno's can give different results but as I have a before and after results from the same dyno you can't really argue with the increase.  My question was how much extra increase would you get from adding headers and filter?

Aftermarket filter will do little to nothing, some of the Aussie BMW superbike teams still use the stock filter, it's that good.....Headers should "normally" provide around 10-12hp increase and a goodly increase in mid range torque. Getting 12hp out of a completely stock engine is a bit "optimistic" IMHO...so if that's the case, fitting quality headers to your "stock tuned" XR will give it another 12hp and bring it up close to RR numbers??...I think not. 

We must also remember, dyno results are often "manipulated" by the operators to make their tune appear good....happens all the time. We run a "Calibrated" helicopter turbine engine dyno at my work and I can manipulate the settings in the software to say anything I like, I can make a 500hp engine appear to have 750hp if I so choose.

As long as the bike is better for you, that's all that matters.

Smithy.

[Antares]

Originally Posted by HelenM

Just to clarify the YouTube video is not one of our bikes, it was a promotional video I saw prior to getting our bikes done.  As I understand it different dyno's can give different results but as I have a before and after results from the same dyno you can't really argue with the increase.  My question was how much extra increase would you get from adding headers and filter?

As I said i'm still sceptical, what gear was that pull done in, as i mentioned it could be low gear restrictions removed, as smithy mentioned they can fudge numbers a bit and all "handheld tuners" like to do that whether thats Brentune, Dynojet, Rapidbike or BHP UK. Either way, if your bike truly gained that much from just a flash then you may had terrible luck with stock engine paired with stock tune, or the opposite, and you have a golden engine that will be able to pick up even more power. Either way, I'm of the opinion that it's the headers that give the most power, air filter maybe another 2-3 bhp IF the rest is all matched with a tune.

[HelenM]

Thank you smithy i appreciate your last post and I'm over the moon at the real word results. no matter how they got there, I love been able to bring the front end up without the clutch which i just could not do before is a win win for me, whether that's down to fuelling or low gear restrictions is completely irrelevant to me. 

I know you post a lot on here and been on quite a journey with your bike so your opinion is valid but the question is, is there much more to be gained from what i have already gained by adding headers considering we are not obviously fans of noisy bikes ?

[smithy]

Originally Posted by HelenM

Thank you smithy i appreciate your last post and I'm over the moon at the real word results. no matter how they got there, I love been able to bring the front end up without the clutch which i just could not do before is a win win for me, whether that's down to fuelling or low gear restrictions is completely irrelevant to me. 

I know you post a lot on here and been on quite a journey with your bike so your opinion is valid but the question is, is there much more to be gained from what i have already gained by adding headers considering we are not obviously fans of noisy bikes ?

"If" you've gained 12hp from just a tune....(which I doubt), you'll get nothing from headers. As mentioned, a quality set of headers and a good tune will be lucky to get that.

On a different note...my bike lifts the front.... off the throttle in 3rd gear, no dipping the clutch or yanking on handlebars...and I have a 42T rear sprocket....but it does have headers and a nice Rapid Bike Evo tune. Economy is also very good with average fuel consumption @ 5.1L/100km.....unless I'm being a twat with the throttle.

Smithy.