Author Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo  (Read 2182 times)

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  • Offline Ant   us

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    Offline Ant

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    Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    on: February 03, 2023, 12:34:07 am
    February 03, 2023, 12:34:07 am
    2016 Gen1
    LeoVince pipe, otherwise stock

    So I've been poking around reading various stuff XR riders have done yet the more I read the more confusing it gets. Maybe because I have no clue about this stuff?

    Flashing, remapping, is all this the same thing?

    Do you need to use a dyno to have this stuff installed?

    I like my XR but according to the internet it's supposed to buck when riding around town and the throttle response blows goats and needs some sort of tune/map/wizardry.

    My riding is roughly 40% around town/highway and 60% mountain twisty and no track days.

    Leave well enough alone or ?

  • Offline af1-windy   gb

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    Offline af1-windy

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #1 on: February 03, 2023, 09:43:33 am
    February 03, 2023, 09:43:33 am
    *Originally Posted by Ant [+]
    2016 Gen1
    LeoVince pipe, otherwise stock

    So I've been poking around reading various stuff XR riders have done yet the more I read the more confusing it gets. Maybe because I have no clue about this stuff?

    Flashing, remapping, is all this the same thing?

    Do you need to use a dyno to have this stuff installed?

    I like my XR but according to the internet it's supposed to buck when riding around town and the throttle response blows goats and needs some sort of tune/map/wizardry.

    My riding is roughly 40% around town/highway and 60% mountain twisty and no track days.

    Leave well enough alone or ?

    I went through the same thought process, bog standard 2017 Gen1..  :084: :187: :087:

    In fairness, for me it rides fine, I'm used to big V twins so the on/off throttle bit I can handle, the dip in the mid range is barely noticeable but is there..

    Anyway, I spoke with the guy at https://bsd.uk.com and he said just leave it stock and let them have if for a couple of hours, £350.00 for a custom map, and all will be sorted. Which to me, being a tight wad Yorkshireman, is music to my wallet, err, I mean ears..  :007: :008:

    I've just got an Oil and filter change to do, fit the manual cam chain adjuster and I'll get it booked in, hopefully by the end of this month. I'll pay particular attention to how it behaves on the way over and again on the journey home after the re-map.

    I'll post result soon after..  :028:
    "When I’m riding my motorcycle, I’m glad to be alive. When I stop riding my motorcycle, I’m glad to be alive" Neil Peart.

  • Offline Antares   gb

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    Offline Antares

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #2 on: February 03, 2023, 10:13:15 am
    February 03, 2023, 10:13:15 am
    *Originally Posted by Ant [+]
    2016 Gen1
    LeoVince pipe, otherwise stock

    So I've been poking around reading various stuff XR riders have done yet the more I read the more confusing it gets. Maybe because I have no clue about this stuff?

    Flashing, remapping, is all this the same thing?

    Do you need to use a dyno to have this stuff installed?

    I like my XR but according to the internet it's supposed to buck when riding around town and the throttle response blows goats and needs some sort of tune/map/wizardry.

    My riding is roughly 40% around town/highway and 60% mountain twisty and no track days.

    Leave well enough alone or ?

    Without going into it, the benefit of a Dyno is to know exactly where you stand. Even 2 exactly identical stock bikes will have slightly different fuelling. PC maps, brentune, Rapidbike premade maps "assume" a baseline and then adjust based on your mods. It's a bit like shooting in the dark, like you know a pint of beer in a pint glass is roughly a pint but you're not going to be able to know 100% accurately until you measure it. That's what a dyno does for you. It establishes a clear and obvious baseline, and that gives a clear direction to tune towards making the finished product much more accurate for YOUR bike. Due to this it can be min-maxed more efficiently, whereas premade maps will always have to be conservative and won't extract 100% of the potential gains, whether that's power, smoothness or fuel consumption.

  • Offline Ant   us

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    Offline Ant

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #3 on: February 03, 2023, 10:05:52 pm
    February 03, 2023, 10:05:52 pm
    *Originally Posted by af1-windy [+]
    I went through the same thought process, bog standard 2017 Gen1..  :084: :187: :087:

    In fairness, for me it rides fine, I'm used to big V twins so the on/off throttle bit I can handle, the dip in the mid range is barely noticeable but is there..

    Anyway, I spoke with the guy at https://bsd.uk.com and he said just leave it stock and let them have if for a couple of hours, £350.00 for a custom map, and all will be sorted. Which to me, being a tight wad Yorkshireman, is music to my wallet, err, I mean ears..  :007: :008:

    I've just got an Oil and filter change to do, fit the manual cam chain adjuster and I'll get it booked in, hopefully by the end of this month. I'll pay particular attention to how it behaves on the way over and again on the journey home after the re-map.

    I'll post result soon after..  :028:

    Looking forward to your results.


  • Offline Ant   us

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    Offline Ant

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #4 on: February 04, 2023, 12:02:50 am
    February 04, 2023, 12:02:50 am
    *Originally Posted by Antares [+]
    Without going into it, the benefit of a Dyno is to know exactly where you stand. Even 2 exactly identical stock bikes will have slightly different fuelling. PC maps, brentune, Rapidbike premade maps "assume" a baseline and then adjust based on your mods. It's a bit like shooting in the dark, like you know a pint of beer in a pint glass is roughly a pint but you're not going to be able to know 100% accurately until you measure it. That's what a dyno does for you. It establishes a clear and obvious baseline, and that gives a clear direction to tune towards making the finished product much more accurate for YOUR bike. Due to this it can be min-maxed more efficiently, whereas premade maps will always have to be conservative and won't extract 100% of the potential gains, whether that's power, smoothness or fuel consumption.

    When a local shop for example creates a custom tune or remapps a bike is that the same thing as a Brentune or Rapidbike? What I'm trying to understand is if all these options are doing the same thing there's just more than one way (if that made sense)

  • Offline af1-windy   gb

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    Offline af1-windy

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #5 on: February 04, 2023, 10:02:06 am
    February 04, 2023, 10:02:06 am
    *Originally Posted by Ant [+]
    When a local shop for example creates a custom tune or remapps a bike is that the same thing as a Brentune or Rapidbike? What I'm trying to understand is if all these options are doing the same thing there's just more than one way (if that made sense)

    I don't really understand how it all works but I assume that when you buy something pre programmed, they have to assume certain things about the bike.  :084: :187:

    When they have your bike on their rolling road they don't have to assume anything, they can see exactly what the bike is doing, in regard to fuel/air etc. and then tweak the settings, ending with accurate settings for your particular bike.

    Just my thoughts on how it works, I could be wrong  :034: and if so, I'm sure there are those on this site that will correct me.. :164: :028: :001:

     :821: windy
     
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  • Offline Antares   gb

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #6 on: February 06, 2023, 03:02:22 pm
    February 06, 2023, 03:02:22 pm
    *Originally Posted by Ant [+]
    When a local shop for example creates a custom tune or remapps a bike is that the same thing as a Brentune or Rapidbike? What I'm trying to understand is if all these options are doing the same thing there's just more than one way (if that made sense)

    It's the same process for brentune, aka rewriting stock values in ECU.

    PCV and Rapidbike are piggyback modules, aka they intercept the values spat out by the ECU and change them before they arrive at injectors/throttle bodies etc. Due to this piggybacks generally have less access to the bike's behaviour, like for a good while PC couldn't adjust timing, now they have an extra module for it, but your ECU can do that anyway.

  • Offline Ant   us

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    Offline Ant

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #7 on: March 03, 2023, 03:34:33 am
    March 03, 2023, 03:34:33 am
    *Originally Posted by af1-windy [+]
    I went through the same thought process, bog standard 2017 Gen1..  :084: :187: :087:

    In fairness, for me it rides fine, I'm used to big V twins so the on/off throttle bit I can handle, the dip in the mid range is barely noticeable but is there..

    Anyway, I spoke with the guy at https://bsd.uk.com and he said just leave it stock and let them have if for a couple of hours, £350.00 for a custom map, and all will be sorted. Which to me, being a tight wad Yorkshireman, is music to my wallet, err, I mean ears..  :007: :008:

    I've just got an Oil and filter change to do, fit the manual cam chain adjuster and I'll get it booked in, hopefully by the end of this month. I'll pay particular attention to how it behaves on the way over and again on the journey home after the re-map.

    I'll post result soon after..  :028:

    Did you post up results and I missed it?

    How'd it go?

  • Offline af1-windy   gb

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    Offline af1-windy

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #8 on: March 03, 2023, 08:04:58 am
    March 03, 2023, 08:04:58 am
    *Originally Posted by Ant [+]
    Did you post up results and I missed it?

    How'd it go?

    I haven't booked it in yet, Hopefully Saturday 11th. I've been busy at home and I work a few Saturday mornings..  :013:

    Don't worry, you haven't missed anything..  :164: :008:
    "When I’m riding my motorcycle, I’m glad to be alive. When I stop riding my motorcycle, I’m glad to be alive" Neil Peart.

  • Offline Belco100   gb

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    Offline Belco100

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    Re: Brentune, Power Commander, Rapidbike Evo
    Reply #9 on: March 03, 2023, 10:18:25 am
    March 03, 2023, 10:18:25 am
    I started of with a standard Gen1 (2019) with just a Leo Vince, thought I would get a base run and was a bit disapointed at only 141hp. The Dyno guy suggested pulling the baffle out as it felt like it was gassing up, and straight into the 150s. The baffle was losing me 9hp! So there is an easy win. Runs very weak low down and very rich high up.



    I then tried a set of headers, and removed the acoustic insert, along with a Bren Tune - I see you are in USA, Bren Tune is a safe bet for a generic tune. What you can see is the big dip in power from 6 - 7,000rpm, which the headers seem to fill but I was a bit shocked just how loud it was. In Dynamic the little pops on overrun which I love turned into cannon fire, so I thought I would try with the baffle in but was a bit wary as I lost 9hp in standard form. Bizarrely it barely made any difference, maybe a hp or two here and there, but nothing that really stood out, and it was still loud but nowhere near as bad.



    I fired up Harry’s Dyno App again and checked the 30 – 80mph full throttle:

      stock 7.95 seconds
      tuned 7.45 seconds
    Roll on was definitely improved and you could happily ride around in top all day and still pull quite strongly when needed and then very strong at the top end.

    I did eventually go for a compromise in the end and put the standard headers back on as I found it just a little too loud for my liking and ended up with just the Bren Tune and Leo Vince with no baffles, and that worked very nice. Still very smooth on the bottom end and very quick at the top, but not quite as strong in the middle - it is the headers that free that middle bit in.

     



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